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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2019 6:45:04 GMT
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Post by Admin on Jun 24, 2019 10:56:10 GMT
Yea - it is part of it all. i have been having this debate / argument again on an American fb page over the past few days - so many people really do see this as a battle between anti / pro psychiatry, & i can see why there are the 2 camps. It twists my head inside out. i think that 'everyone' is 'wrong' about it all. The article is right - the severely mentally ill are left torn to pieces in the middle of it all. In combination with the internet & totally opposing ideologies, not just within all this, but loads of other areas, society is & will increasingly tear itself apart. But at a deeper level that may well all be orchestrated. Anyone that has / does speak any real sense on everything is attacked, ignored & denied, But then i would say only around 2% of the global population have any kind of genuine sense & real sanity.
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Post by snowstorm on Jun 24, 2019 12:48:47 GMT
The article does make a lot of good points, including how peer workers may be underappreciated and the whole work of the peers means they are reminded of their own experiences over and over again, while not being paid enough.
I think more and more that recognising severe mental illness as a disability rather than different camps arguing over whether it's an illness or not, what kind etc would be more helpful.
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Post by Admin on Jun 24, 2019 13:01:16 GMT
I think more and more that recognising severe mental illness as a disability rather than different camps arguing over whether it's an illness or not, what kind etc would be more helpful. Severe Schizophrenia is classified as a severe disability by the World Health Organisation & the UN, & classed as a worse disability than blindness.
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Post by snowstorm on Jun 24, 2019 13:14:33 GMT
Thanks Admin. I looked up on the WHO and it emphasises the severity, says that it is treatable (though we know not necessarily completely) and is associated with significant disability. www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/schizophreniaI just mean a function impaired disability as opposed to, say, a learning disability, but just as severe and life altering.
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Post by Admin on Jun 24, 2019 13:25:50 GMT
I think more and more that recognising severe mental illness as a disability rather than different camps arguing over whether it's an illness or not, what kind etc would be more helpful. No one is ever going to agree on what schizophrenia is / isn't because no one knows what it is & no one knows the aetiology. Atheist scientific materialism / biomedical psychiatry / pharma will never see it as primarily anything beyond a biological illness / condition. Everything / everyone outside of that will Never stop having every endless theory & opinion under the Sun imaginable on it all. All the people that always have & do take a highly nuanced, comprehensive & integral / holistic view on this & every other area & offer comprehensive approaches to it all will continue to be ridiculed, ignored & denied. Psychiatry VS Psychology Anti VS Pro Psychiatry Atheist scientific materialism VS religion / spirituality Different religions VS different religions. Left VS Right wing politics. Capitalism VS Socialism & systemic alternatives. It is Truly Insane.
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Post by Admin on Jun 24, 2019 13:32:45 GMT
Thanks Admin. I looked up on the WHO and it emphasises the severity, says that it is treatable (though we know not necessarily completely) and is associated with significant disability. www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/schizophreniaI just mean a function impaired disability as opposed to, say, a learning disability, but just as severe and life altering. Yes - But the UN are part of the Soros / Communist / Marxist / Illuminati Plot to enslave the World / humanity - so they can't really be trusted.
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Post by snowstorm on Jun 24, 2019 13:52:55 GMT
Yes - But the UN are part of the Soros / Communist / Marxist / Illuminati Plot to enslave the World / humanity - so they can't really be trusted. I'd love to know the tone of how you said that
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Post by Admin on Jun 24, 2019 13:54:13 GMT
I'd love to know the tone of how you said that Deadly serious obviously. :-)
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Post by snowstorm on Jun 24, 2019 13:59:53 GMT
Such a waste of (life)time too. Surely the art of debate also means listening to the opposing sides, reaching a conclusion and moving forward, even if amendments have to be made along the way with new information.
Still think a lot of it revolves around human rights - survivors wanting/needing/deserving them and authorities trying to block that.
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Post by Admin on Jun 24, 2019 14:15:02 GMT
Such a waste of (life)time too. Surely the art of debate also means listening to the opposing sides, reaching a conclusion and moving forward, even if amendments have to be made along the way with new information. Still think a lot of it revolves around human rights - survivors wanting/needing/deserving them and authorities trying to block that. A complete waste of Life / Time having exactly the same circular & bitter arguments; that intrinsically Never change. i have really studied the anti-psychiatry / survivor / alternative mental health movement. What happens in the USA a lot, is a lot of people being very badly treated by the mental health system / psychiatry who have Nothing wrong with them - & so you can understand that they then feel the ways that they do. But they can't then apply that to people who actually do suffer severe mental illness, this is part of what is so mad with it all. & we are back with all the severity / aetiology / philosophical / ontological / Epistemological / Phenomenological questions around it all. The UK society / mental health system / psychiatry / psychology is different - the UK psyche is different to the USA one. Of course giving everyone / implementing full human rights is pivotal to it all, but that Never happens. At the end of it all who cares who is right / wrong - you can see the wisdom the the Sages - Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing, there is a field. I’ll meet you there. When the soul lies down in that grass, the world is too full to talk about. Ideas, language, even the phrase ‘each other’ doesn’t make any sense. Rumi.
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Post by snowstorm on Jun 24, 2019 14:15:34 GMT
Yes - But the UN are part of the Soros / Communist / Marxist / Illuminati Plot to enslave the World / humanity - so they can't really be trusted. Was think about world 'control' the other day - and films, funnily enough. In a film, e.g. LOTR, the good characters are doing their best, making mistakes, conflicted at times, arguing etc while the baddies are 2D, seeming never to make an error, or have a difference of opinion, until the final battle when they get completely annihilated. Truth is the the baddies would be making the same if not more mistakes, arguing, incompetent, nasty, jealous of each other and any 'control' would be flimsy. Also there are about 20 good characters against thousands of bad ones. Not v realistic
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Post by Admin on Jun 24, 2019 14:22:56 GMT
Yes - But the UN are part of the Soros / Communist / Marxist / Illuminati Plot to enslave the World / humanity - so they can't really be trusted. Was think about world 'control' the other day - and films, funnily enough. In a film, e.g. LOTR, the good characters are doing their best, making mistakes, conflicted at times, arguing etc while the baddies are 2D, seeming never to make an error, or have a difference of opinion, until the final battle when they get completely annihilated. Truth is the the baddies would be making the same if not more mistakes, arguing, incompetent, nasty, jealous of each other and any 'control' would be flimsy. Also there are about 20 good characters against thousands of bad ones. Not v realistic Good observation.
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Post by snowstorm on Jun 24, 2019 14:30:25 GMT
Could a 'flimsy' nasty world control last thousands and thousands of years? If comparing with empires they change, they crumble, they fall because they are flawed - they do not stay the same.
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Post by snowstorm on Jun 24, 2019 14:34:09 GMT
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