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Post by Admin on Jul 12, 2022 21:37:21 GMT
Modern psychiatry. Western psychiatry?. Modern psychiatry. Is this your experience ? Do you recognise this service locally? No contentious issues? Professor Bentall (Opinion, 26 February) writes well about the realities of mental disorders, but paints a less than complete picture of modern psychiatry. Psychiatrists, clinical psychologists, psychotherapists and other professionals work together for the benefit of patients. We share a common goal to improve the lives of those with mental ill health – indeed guidelines for treatment are decided by multidisciplinary teams. Some people do get better without medication, but there is a strong body of evidence that for many people, medication reduces the risk of relapse and harmful behaviour, and enables them to live full lives. While psychiatry is a medical speciality, we do not recognise the narrow biomedical approach that he suggests. In order to help the understanding, treatment and support of those with mental disorders, psychiatry brings together in equal measure the biological, psychological and social. Remove any one of these three, and I’m not sure what you would have, but it’s not psychiatry. Professor Simon Wessely President, Royal College of Psychiatrists www.theguardian.com/society/2016/feb/26/a-fuller-picture-of-modern-psychiatryPs. I'm not that keen on the guardian (well off readership).but because it is independent there are a columnists with differing political views.eg I follow Aditya Chakraboty.Ignore Simon Jenkins. i agree with Simon. i can want my ideal World all i like - it's Not the realities - But i don't think the picture with psychiatry & the mental health system is as some people try & present it all. Things have moved on, even from the 1990's.
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Post by flyingcarpet46 on Jul 13, 2022 6:44:43 GMT
Indeed we can all want our Ideal worlds , as long as we can cope with our world not being ideal?
You like Simon Jenkins. Really! Well, I guess he has views on a decent civilisation.
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Post by flyingcarpet46 on Jul 13, 2022 7:02:57 GMT
I would hope psychiatry has moved/is moving on. But it's views on underlying 'chemical imbalances' have still a long way to go . I think it is much more fruitful to understand our biochemistry/physiology as a medium without, as yet, fully understanding what causes/underpins changes/fluctuations in this medium.
But we go with what makes most sense to us individually. Psychiatry meanwhile goes with current 'mainstream ' views which it has the power to impose.
Certainly it claims scientific evidence but science , for all its method, is itself constantly developing and subject to social/cultural influences and limitations in its research methods.
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Post by flyingcarpet46 on Jul 13, 2022 7:09:54 GMT
From what I hear and read psychiatry in 2022 temains as controversial as it was 50 years ago . I'm not persuaded it has made huge strides eg Wellesly's statement - though the nature and range of medications has certainly expanded.
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Post by Admin on Jul 13, 2022 9:14:57 GMT
I would hope psychiatry has moved/is moving on. But it's views on underlying 'chemical imbalances' have still a long way to go . I think it is much more fruitful to understand our biochemistry/physiology as a medium without, as yet, fully understanding what causes/underpins changes/fluctuations in this medium. But we go with what makes most sense to us individually. Psychiatry meanwhile goes with current 'mainstream ' views which it has the power to impose. Certainly it claims scientific evidence but science , for all its method, is itself constantly developing and subject to social/cultural influences and limitations in its research methods. Modern neurology / brain science is massively complex. We don't know is the real answer. i think that there is the evidence for some conditions being predominantly genetic / epigenetic brain conditions. Until we know more there is always going to be the same controversy & debate.
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Post by Admin on Jul 13, 2022 15:04:23 GMT
From what I hear and read psychiatry in 2022 temains as controversial as it was 50 years ago . I'm not persuaded it has made huge strides eg Wellesly's statement - though the nature and range of medications has certainly expanded. Psychiatry will always be controversial - same as politics & religions.
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Post by flyingcarpet46 on Jul 13, 2022 22:28:33 GMT
[psychiatry has moved on]. But how about implementation of the broader perspectives? www.theguardian.com/society/2022/jul/11/people-with-depression-stagnating-in-uk-healthcare-systemIn the UK, antidepressants and psychological therapies are both offered as first-line treatments and have been shown to be roughly equally effective. Evidence suggests that people often benefit most when they get both treatments simultaneously. However, the latest work suggests that people are given medication at about twice the rate of psychological treatment such as cognitive behavioural therapy (CBT). It is known that about one in five people will not respond to first-line treatments, but the study found a referral rate to secondary care of as low as 5%-6% in some studies. This, the authors said, suggests many may be “stagnating” in primary care, not getting better, but not getting more specialist help either. I'm not keen on seeing CBT judged as adequately addressing 'external factors' , but that's bye the bye
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Post by Admin on Jul 14, 2022 3:40:35 GMT
[psychiatry has moved on]. But how about implementation of the broader perspectives? www.theguardian.com/society/2022/jul/11/people-with-depression-stagnating-in-uk-healthcare-systemIn the UK, antidepressants and psychological therapies are both offered as first-line treatments and have been shown to be roughly equally effective. Evidence suggests that people often benefit most when they get both treatments simultaneously. However, the latest work suggests that people are given medication at about twice the rate of psychological treatment such as cognitive behavioural therapy (CBT). It is known that about one in five people will not respond to first-line treatments, but the study found a referral rate to secondary care of as low as 5%-6% in some studies. This, the authors said, suggests many may be “stagnating” in primary care, not getting better, but not getting more specialist help either. I'm not keen on seeing CBT judged as adequately addressing 'external factors' , but that's bye the bye i'm all for far more comprehensive & appropriate psychological / social approaches to mental health care within an integral model, with far more of a balance within & between the biological, psychogenic, sociological & spiritual, & is why i have campaigned for 20 years for a paradigm shift within society & the system to an integral model & approach to health care. Can't see it happening under the Tories or current Labor?
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Post by flyingcarpet46 on Jul 14, 2022 19:15:40 GMT
No. Can't see it either. And what hasn't already been outsourced/closed will be.
There have been brief moments in the last 50 years when there was a chance of improved and extended mental health provision but the vision, a more integrated approach, was appropriated and elements provided on the cheap and rationed.
And then of course there have long been entrenched positions on both sides of psychiatric/psychological arguments. And political divides.
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Post by Admin on Jul 14, 2022 19:27:44 GMT
No. Can't see it either. And what hasn't already been outsourced/closed will be. Yes - NHS / Welfare / Social Care system / Universal Declaration of Human Rights was good for a while as envisioned at the end of WW2 by genuine socialists - Bye Bye to all that now. Think i said at the start of our conversations - there has been some 3 thousand years of recorded organised dissent with the system, 500 years of all the same arguments around Industrial Capitalism & health & social issues. The same debates within Civilization / Humanity from the beginning of recorded history concerning 'madness / mental illness' & Civilization. It never intrinsically changes, pockets of better treatment of the 'mad' here & there - it ebbs & flows. The World is now controlled by Banking / Corporate / Political Elites - up to them now what they envision for humanity. The World / Cosmos / Humanity is Duality - you will never get people to agree with each other, hence there will never be a more ideal World - Conflicts / War / Division is intrinsic to Humanity, always has been & always will be, until we destroy the planet & ourselves. You will never get any agreement on mental health / politics / socioeconomics / religions (including Atheism) / culture. Sad & tragic, but that is the way it all is.
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Post by flyingcarpet46 on Jul 17, 2022 20:26:21 GMT
Ebbs and flows with maybe a few dramatic events thrown in.
Re humanity. I can see how a story of a Garden of Eden ,an idyllic place, from which humans were banished to a life of hardship and danger arose. Not so sure about the Serpent offering Eve an apple.
There is a lot of romanticism about Mother Earth but being/staying alive on this earth is not easy. And our universe is/has been exceedingly turbulent.
What is puzzling to me is the duality - an awareness of 'the other side of the coin' - and wanting it, less hardship and, of course, no suffering. (Do we still have dualities or is it all spectrums now?)
Of course, that is what is said to be the Buddha's enlightment. There is suffering, but it can be taken care of.
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Post by Admin on Jul 17, 2022 20:40:29 GMT
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Post by flyingcarpet46 on Jul 18, 2022 8:26:34 GMT
Dr James Davies and DSM
Very interesting. I appreciate the forum for making this available/accessible(the internet offering what it was perceived ss being possible of achieving)
But in these times where there is an inundation of info, little will come out of Davies' findings?
Am only half way through the video. What more is to come, I wonder.
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Post by Admin on Jul 18, 2022 9:10:45 GMT
Dr James Davies and DSM Very interesting. I appreciate the forum for making this available/accessible(the internet offering what it was perceived ss being possible of achieving) But in these times where there is an inundation of info, little will come out of Davies' findings? Am only half way through the video. What more is to come, I wonder. i think it's just written off as 'anti psychiatry'.
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Post by flyingcarpet on Jul 18, 2022 11:05:35 GMT
Probably. Positions to defend? Pro/anti.
Davies has researched the DSM's looking at primary sources and archives but we go by soundbites these days. (A new epigenetic mh disorder relating to concentration,?)
Have to confess I fell asleep while listening to the second half. Well, the weather is hot though only 19° here.
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