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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 17:18:58 GMT
I'm sorry, Admin, that you have been through this all your life and that things have panned out as they have, but none of it has been your fault and at least you have tried to do the right thing and change things for the better for yourself and others. It is the responsibility of those who have the ability to do so to genuinely improve the help and treatment people receive, be it on their heads for not doing so, it certainly should be. i can fully see the point that the 'drop the disorder'; anti / critical / alternative areas are making, i just don't think that can come at a denial of what comes under the realities of mental health experiences / difficulties - there has to be an associated reform of the society / system in how everyone is treated, & people need proper & appropriate understanding, help & support. i can understand the argument as to how are you meant to recover from a label / diagnosis - But i can also understand that if suffering serious difficulties it needs to be acknowledged within this society / system & is needed for what social help & support is available. i don't see this conundrum being resolved within the current society / system. Then there is the fact that a lot of people don't seem to care or have any genuine compassion for people deemed to be suffering mental illnesses; psychological / emotional & associated social difficulties. Sadly the genuinely liberal attitudes & approaches also appear to be waning. It certainly seems that way.
Drop the Disorder has become more about Twitter battles, sadly, and is more from a feminist perspective, ignoring/trivialising the issues men face in the system. Not to say that their main arguments have no relevance and I don't like the stigmatising language any more than they do, also there seems to be a bit of favouritism regarding who gets to post and who doesn't.
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Post by Admin on Dec 28, 2018 17:40:48 GMT
........there seems to be a bit of favouritism regarding who gets to post and who doesn't. i was banned from their fb page.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 17:41:47 GMT
They won't approve any of my posts either, lol. It's a bit childish tbh.
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Post by Admin on Dec 28, 2018 17:54:27 GMT
They won't approve any of my posts either, lol. It's a bit childish tbh. It's all very childish & immature. You know my personal opinion on the whole thing, at this stage of things i think that 'everyone' 'needs' to move away from all the ideologies & polemics.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 18:33:53 GMT
The thing is they have more power to change things than we do, but they won't do that banging on about it online, or at their AD4E! days.
As practising psychotherapists/psychologists they could be changing the system from within, but maybe they don't want to lose their jobs. No one wants to be on benefits, especially in the current climate, but ethically they are compromised working in mh services. I know I would not want to be involved with them.
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Post by Admin on Dec 28, 2018 18:47:08 GMT
The thing is they have more power to change things than we do, but they won't do that banging on about it online, or at their AD4E! days. As practising psychotherapists/psychologists they could be changing the system from within, but maybe they don't want to lose their jobs. No one wants to be on benefits, especially in the current climate, but ethically they are compromised working in mh services. I know I would not want to be involved with them. The entire field i think has a certain toxicity. It is like a kind of virus. Where is the practical help & support for people - this is i think the growing issue - all the talk in the world doesn't make any difference to the actual realities of peoples lives. There needs to be proper investment into proper services for everyone, that genuinely improves their lives in practical ways. Seems to be a lot of increasing elitism / exclusivity / exclusion within some of the alternative / recovery areas. i can't remember the guys's name, one of the alternative / anti psychiatry Doctors in Ireland - i said to him that he was still profiting out of it all & being paid a lot of money from the current system, he didn't answer. A lot of the people within all the anti / alternative psychiatry areas won't speak to me, how is that being inclusive or looking to improve services & treatment for all people? Some of the most vicious personal verbal attacks have come from the anti / alternative areas, some of the open dialogue people have been terrible in the way that they have communicated with me - how is that in line with what open dialogue is meant to be about? Something is Not right with all of it.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 18:49:26 GMT
The thing is they have more power to change things than we do, but they won't do that banging on about it online, or at their AD4E! days. As practising psychotherapists/psychologists they could be changing the system from within, but maybe they don't want to lose their jobs. No one wants to be on benefits, especially in the current climate, but ethically they are compromised working in mh services. I know I would not want to be involved with them. i can't remember the guys's name, one of the alternative / anti psychiatry Doctors in Ireland - i said to him that he was still profiting out of it all & being paid a lot of money from the current system, he didn't answer. Terry Lynch?
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Post by Admin on Dec 28, 2018 18:50:16 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 18:55:58 GMT
It's the only one I can think of. I don't really converse with any of the 'esteemed' ones, and they just ignore me most of the time. He does pop up on there occasionally.
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Post by Admin on Dec 28, 2018 19:10:19 GMT
It's the only one I can think of. I don't really converse with any of the 'esteemed' ones, and they just ignore me most of the time. He does pop up on there occasionally. i have written to & communicated with loads of them over years. The thing is - OK the current mental health system / treatment - biomedical pharmacological / psychiatric industry & this current socioeconomic system is in certain / many ways crap (especially for certain demographics of people) & we can envision far better alternatives - & then what? It never seems to get beyond any of that & no one is saying anything new. When & how does it actually translate into proper treatment & genuine socioeconomic & systemic change? i can't see really what is different in the arguments from the 50's (& long before) & it's all been wrangled out decades ago. i can't help thinking as well that this whole pharmacological area is largely a done deal & has been for decades - certain agendas within the establishment / industry / deep state have moved well beyond it all into other areas & are looking at full system control & dominance - gene editing, nano-tech, smart dust, AI, EMF-tech etc. It will all make psychopharmacology child's play.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 19:17:03 GMT
It's the only one I can think of. I don't really converse with any of the 'esteemed' ones, and they just ignore me most of the time. He does pop up on there occasionally. i have written to & communicated with loads of them over years. The thing is - OK the current mental health system / treatment - biomedical pharmacological / psychiatric industry & this current socioeconomic system is in certain / many ways crap (especially for certain demographics of people) & we can envision far better alternatives - & then what? It never seems to get beyond any of that & no one is saying anything new. When & how does it actually translate into proper treatment & genuine socioeconomic & systemic change? i can't see really what is different in the arguments from the 50's (& long before) & it's all been wrangled out decades ago. i can't help thinking as well that this whole pharmacological area is largely a done deal & has been for decades - certain agendas within the establishment / industry / deep state have moved well beyond it all into other areas & are looking at full system control & dominance - gene editing, nano-tech, smart dust, AI, EMF-tech etc. It will all make psychopharmacology child's play. I agree, but then we are paranoid and delusional schizophrenics, we'll be edited out soon, one way or another.
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Post by Admin on Dec 28, 2018 19:19:32 GMT
The thing is - OK the current mental health system / treatment - biomedical pharmacological / psychiatric industry & this current socioeconomic system is in certain / many ways crap (especially for certain demographics of people) & we can envision far better alternatives - & then what? It never seems to get beyond any of that & no one is saying anything new. When & how does it actually translate into proper treatment & genuine socioeconomic & systemic change? i can't see really what is different in the arguments from the 50's (& long before) & it's all been wrangled out decades ago. i was going to buy a copy of The Bitterest Pills: The Troubling Story of Antipsychotic Drugs by J. Moncrieff, but what is the point? It's Not saying anything new. i gave away almost all the mental health books i had - i don't see much point in reading them all any more, other than a few seminal texts. It's just people regurgitating the same things in the same areas.
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Post by Admin on Dec 28, 2018 19:21:23 GMT
I agree, but then we are paranoid and delusional schizophrenics, we'll be edited out soon, one way or another. True & ironically the only real experts on it all.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2018 19:39:56 GMT
I agree, but then we are paranoid and delusional schizophrenics, we'll be edited out soon, one way or another. True & ironically the only real experts on it all. Which is why we need to be got rid of.
I think there's a lot more to 'schizophrenia' and 'paranoid and delusional schizophrenics' than meets the eye, yes we suffer for it, but it's on a different level from most people's experiences, and it's certainly not just a genetic brain disease; it suits the establishment to denigrate and stigmatise us, because there's a lot more truth and worth in the content of our 'episodes' than they would want others to believe.
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Post by Admin on Dec 28, 2018 20:03:00 GMT
Which is why we need to be got rid of. I think there's a lot more to 'schizophrenia' and 'paranoid and delusional schizophrenics' than meets the eye, yes we suffer for it, but it's on a different level from most people's experiences, and it's certainly not just a genetic brain disease; it suits the establishment to denigrate and stigmatise us, because there's a lot more truth and worth in the content of our 'episodes' than they would want others to believe. Yes there is an element of truth in all that. & of course it's just put down to paranoia, delusions & denied. Interesting that people like Jung, John Weir Perry, Loren Mosher & many others are virtually scrubbed from history & very derided, denied, denigrated & sidelined, by all 'sides' - it's the same story isn't it - dialogue / debate is only allowed within certain carefully defined & narrow parameters. i don't think the real agendas are bothered by all the anti / pro psychiatry argument - it's just more divide & rule. Same as Left / Right wing politics - Atheist / Exoteric Religion - etc - keeps everyone fighting, controlled, stupid & dumbed down.
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