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Post by Admin on Dec 10, 2018 18:56:01 GMT
Look at the history of it all. It is largely just a constant catalogue of abuse & bad treatment - Mental Health History Timeline studymore.org.uk/mhhtim.htm
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Post by Admin on Dec 10, 2018 18:59:32 GMT
i still feel that it won't all fundamentally change until the wider society / system / 'civilisation' is genuinely sane & civilised & i think that we're looking at another 200 years at least before humanity collectively does something to create a genuinely civilised World.
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Post by snowstorm on Dec 10, 2018 19:13:14 GMT
I do think there is a big difference between being a danger to self and a danger to others. Bungee jumping can be a danger to self, many things are. Another problem with the Mental Health Act Review recommendations is that a lot of choice is meant to be Advance Choice - hardly an option for first episode sufferers.
If it is an illness, that's what it is and people deserve full rights. No one wants anyone to get hurt because of that illness, but at the moment everyone forced into treatment is subject to hurt in some way.
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Post by Admin on Dec 10, 2018 19:22:03 GMT
I do think there is a big difference between being a danger to self and a danger to others. Bungee jumping can be a danger to self, many things are. Another problem with the Mental Health Act Review recommendations is that a lot of choice is meant to be Advance Choice - hardly an option for first episode sufferers. If it is an illness, that's what it is and people deserve full rights. No one wants anyone to get hurt because of that illness, but at the moment everyone forced into treatment is subject to hurt in some way. i agree - my first episode psychosis i think that it could have been far better responded to, approached & treated. But things could have been addressed far better long before then as well, & subsequently. i have always felt that the general / mainstream understandings & approaches to mental health is largely wrong & that there are far better alternatives to understanding, approaching & treating it all. i have always felt that the general / mainstream society / system / culture / 'civilisation' in the way it operates is largely unhealthy, sick & wrong. What am i / 'we' meant to do to change it all? The realities of this World' society / system / 'civilisation' is what it all is.
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Post by snowstorm on Dec 10, 2018 19:23:23 GMT
I suppose so much of it hinges on risk assessment and crucially different techniques that can minimise things like harmful voices and paranoia, not just the sledgehammer effect of drugs.
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Post by Admin on Dec 10, 2018 19:25:27 GMT
i also can't see pharma / psychiatry / the mental health / biomedical system changing under the dominant Atheist scientism materialist paradigm.
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Post by Admin on Dec 10, 2018 19:26:26 GMT
I suppose so much of it hinges on risk assessment and crucially different techniques that can minimise things like harmful voices and paranoia, not just the sledgehammer effect of drugs. Back with the same endless circular argument about the nature of & best approaches to 'mental illnesses'.
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Post by snowstorm on Dec 10, 2018 19:49:44 GMT
I suppose so much of it hinges on risk assessment and crucially different techniques that can minimise things like harmful voices and paranoia, not just the sledgehammer effect of drugs. Back with the same endless circular argument about the nature of & best approaches to 'mental illnesses'. Yes, how to get away from falling into the trap of that. We need a test case that explores the legal arguments around illness, capacity and human rights.
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Post by Admin on Dec 10, 2018 20:00:45 GMT
Yes, how to get away from falling into the trap of that. We need a test case that explores the legal arguments around illness, capacity and human rights. The only solution to the aetiology debate is imo am integral model. So complex as to resolving all the areas that mental health goes into, & then applying a genuinely universal / standard humane model & treatment. As i say, i'm not sure that it is possible within the realities of this current society / system / 'civilisation'. You would have to transform the entire media / educational / medical / legal / cultural realities around it all.
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Post by snowstorm on Dec 10, 2018 20:14:10 GMT
How does change of this magnitude happen? There are other examples of sections of society that were vilified and now are embraced by comparison. At the very least we could have the same rights as in Northern Ireland too; www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5709686/Not enough, but an attempt to put capacity to make a decision on a par with that of physical illness. It just doesn't fully acknowledge that mental illness is a no fault disability.
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Post by snowstorm on Dec 11, 2018 6:25:21 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2018 8:26:05 GMT
I do think there is a big difference between being a danger to self and a danger to others. Bungee jumping can be a danger to self, many things are. Another problem with the Mental Health Act Review recommendations is that a lot of choice is meant to be Advance Choice - hardly an option for first episode sufferers. If it is an illness, that's what it is and people deserve full rights. No one wants anyone to get hurt because of that illness, but at the moment everyone forced into treatment is subject to hurt in some way. www.hearing-voices.org/news/alternative-mental-health-act-review/
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2018 8:34:46 GMT
Yeah it's such a complicated diagnosis as no one symptom is common to all suffering it, and while there are similarities there's so much individualism too. They just don't know enough about it, and the response from services is too much of a 'one size fits all' approach, meds and very little else. They don't work for everyone, and are not a cure, just a sticking plaster. A genuinely compassionate system would put people before profit and actually try to permanently alleviate the symptoms without the use of meds for life, which are very unhealthy, they would try to find an actual cure or at least make 'healthier' drugs cheaper instead of more expensive. But given that the condition has many causes there also needs to be more comprehensive and alternative methods of treatment available, obviously. It's very obvious but for some reason not popular with those who make the decisions on what should be on offer to people.
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Post by Admin on Dec 11, 2018 19:21:29 GMT
“Schizophrenia is a cruel disease. The lives of those affected are often chronicles of constricted experiences, muted emotions, missed opportunities, unfulfilled expectations. It leads to a twilight existence, a twentieth century underground man. The fate of these patients has been worsened by our propensity to misunderstand, our failure to provide adequate treatment and rehabilitation, our meager research efforts. A disease which should be found, in the phrase of T.S. Eliot, in the "frigid purgatorial fires" has become through our ignorance and neglect a living hell.”
― E. Fuller Torrey, Surviving Schizophrenia: A Manual for Families, Patients, and Providers
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Post by snowstorm on Dec 12, 2018 0:52:13 GMT
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